Read the full story here at :
AP - Wednesday, October 21
KUALA LUMPUR, Malaysia – A Malaysian opposition activist may have been strangled and assaulted before he plunged to his death outside the office of the country's anti-corruption agency, Thailand's top criminal forensics expert told a coroner's inquest Wednesday.
Pornthip Rojanasunand, who heads the Thai Central Institute of Forensic Science, said there was an 80 percent chance that Teoh Beng Hock's death was a homicide as some injuries on his body were inconsistent with a fall from a high place.
Her testimony at the inquest shed new light on Teoh's death as it contrasted with evidence given by two Malaysian government pathologists, who claimed Teoh had most likely committed suicide, said Gobind Singh Deo, a lawyer for Teoh's family.
"Many significant features on Teoh's death have been left out by the two other pathologists. This to a very great extent eliminates the theory that Teoh committed suicide. Given her evidence, it's quite clear that it's homicide," he said.
Based on autopsy reports and photos taken from the site where he died, Pornthip told the inquest that marks around Teoh's neck showed he may have been strangled while injury to his anus was caused by penetration with an object before his fall. His skull fracture was also not typical of an injury from a fall but more compatible with being struck by a blunt force, she said.
Pornthip told the inquest she had conducted over 10,000 autopsies in her career, of which more than 100 deaths dealt with fatal falls from high places. She produced photographic evidence of another case, which has similar injuries to those around Teoh's neck to show the possibility of strangulation.
Teoh was probably alive when he hit the ground but may have been unconscious before the fall, she said.
These comments by Porntip raise questions : "marks around Teoh's neck showed he may have been strangled while injury to his anus was caused by penetration with an object before his fall".
Teoh was last seen alive around 6 a.m. He was quite alive and well at that time. His interview with the MACC had concluded by 3 a.m. Witnesses at the Inquest have testified that Teoh and one more person even had an argument in the toilet sometime between 3 a.m. and 6 a.m.
If he was abused and strangled (or vice versa) it must have occured after he was last seen alive and well at 6 am. If this is a homicide, there must also be a motive.
Who stands to gain what if Teoh was murdered?
If fingers are pointing at the MACC, what would the MACC stand to gain from Teoh's death? The MACC had found Teoh a willing and cooperative "witness" who had actually 'spilled the beans' on their investigations into allegations of corruption in Selangor. Why murder a 'star' witness?
There was a criminal investigation going on. Who stands to gain most from Teoh's death.
20 comments:
Bro Syed, you asked that who stands to gain from his death.
Are you implying that you agree that he was murdered ?
If he was murdered why would our local investigators claim it was suicide, when they should be doing a thorough investigation on the murderer or murderers ?
Bro
1. We only have MACC's testimony that TBH was a "co-operative" witness. There is no independent corroboration of this.
2. TBH did not spill anything. There is no evidence or testimony of him spilling anything. He was called up by the MACC as a witness and not as a suspect.
3. The MACC asked him about some invoices and copies of it found in the hard disc of his laptop. He was supposed to return the next day with more paperwork. How did these docs in the possession of MACC make it's way to a website - T4TBH - and what was the intention behind this act?
4. The guard at MACC's office testified that he only heard 1 Chinese word uttered loudly, not a prolonged row.
5. Motive? Who has to gain? There's no need to speculate on motive. The judge in the Altantuya case ruled that motive was not important!!
6. Those who think some other MACC witnesses could have had reasons to off TBH must reckon with the incredible scenario of them carrying out that act in MACC's offices (totally unpremeditated but drawing suspicion on themselves) while the MACC claims they all went home and left these guys alone in their office!!
There's more to this case than meets the eye!!
dpp
We are all of 1 race, the Human Race
Generally speaking, if you have a "star witness" in your pocket, shouldn't you have taken steps to protect him in the first place?
Anyone who had a tough full day would have been too sleepy to drive at 10pm, let alone at 3am. Assuming that he were to drive home, only to crash his car, and died. Who gains, who rugi?
I do not believe that MACC has got anything to do with his death. But I believe that they should have given him full protection. TQ.
Comfortably Numb
Mungkin di dalam hal kepakaran doktor doktor yang
berkaitan dengan membuat kajian kes beng hock kita bolih
cari ilham dari 'times higher education supplement 'university
ranking untuk membantu kita menilai kepakaran doktor doktor
tersebut.
Ada kemungkinan besar Doktor Melayu yang terlibat adalah
dari university tempatan [ukm/um/usm ] . mungkin semasa
doktor itu lulus , ranking universitinya di dalam lingkungan
top 1000 atau bottom 1000. Kini um sudah masuk dalam lingkungan
top 200. faham faham sajalah period itu adalah period
universiti kita di dalam peringkat universiti kangkung lagi.
Si Doktor india itu pula nampaknya macam ' india mari' .Kita
sudah lihat bagaimana di dalam kes tun salleh dulu, hakim
dari benua india/sri lanka bolih bagi jawapan yang berbau'
anything you say ,sir! '. Ini adalah kerana mereka mempunyai
falsafah yang super taksub-menukar gol pos kebenaran
ikut kemahuan tuan yang dapat hulurkan 'laksa laksa' rupees!
Tuan Syed,
For a different take on this "hot" issue, this blog:
http://ktemoc.blogspot.com/
is kind of interesting.
Avidsurfer
It's said that some movies/books/stories are not to be missed. But sometimes we missed them because we were not aware of their existence.
Here's one fascinating story (although it has no connection with this blog post, Maaf Tuan Syed) from the New York Times.
David Rohde, a NYT journalist, was abducted along with his Afghan assistant and driver, while on his way to interview a Taliban chief. He was held for 7 months, all that time all three of them feared they would be executed or beheaded by their captors, before making a successful escape. After regaining his freedom, he wrote an account of his experiences which can be read here:
http://tinyurl.com/yf6plg4
Happy reading!
Avidsurfer
Dear Syed Akbar Ali,
How come this Dr Porn managed to come out as much as 80%? She never examine TBH's body. Her conclusions are based on the 3rd party evidence such as photos etc etc.
Thank you.
the observer-
"... interview with the MACC had concluded by 3 a.m. ...testified that Teoh and one more person even had an argument in the toilet sometime between 3 a.m. and 6 a.m. "
Believe half of what you see, and nothing of what you hear unless u verify it for yourself. Evidence dont lie, witnesses do. Especially when witnesses have something to hide.
.. what would the MACC stand to gain from Teoh's death? .. a willing and cooperative "witness" who had actually 'spilled the beans' on their investigations into allegations of corruption in Selangor. Why murder a 'star' witness?"
Ditto above. Witnesses who are guilty and have something to hide, will lie. As simple as that.
Remember, almost every witness we have, every account we have of the incident came from MACC.
But to be fair, I doubt that this is a conspiracy. No sir, it was most likely an accident. An interrogation that went too far. And everyone panicked, which explains why MACC took so long to report the crime to the police (despite they being ex police).
"How come this Dr Porn managed to come out as much as 80%? She never examine TBH's body. Her conclusions are based on the 3rd party evidence such as photos etc etc.
Thank you.
the observer-"
Because she is an expert and we are amateurs. Please go to internet and do a little research on the background of this highly respected lady, then you can decide to believe what she said or not.
thank you.
where are the 'bean' that teoh spilled????..... MACC would have charged the suspected EXCO member by now if they have the 'beans' lah bro...
MUST NOT ONLY BE FAIR BUT SEEN FAIR AS WELL!!!! CREDIBILITY OF MACC!!
Don't know la Syed.
I remembered when Teoh Beng Hock was murdered, you said it was suicide. Now that we have a credible expert saying it's most likely homicide, you change your tune.
Anyway, if Teoh was sodomized before his death, all I can say is that is the intention to kill him is there. You wouldn't want your victim to run around saying he has been rape would you? It's not just Teoh's death that arouse suspicion. Even until today, we do not know why Altantuya was killed. Why would 2 bodyguards belonging to Najid would want to kill her? What's their motive?
What is point of harping on being an Islamic state if we cannot even serve justice to those who died in such horrible manners? What is so Islamic about us?
Said
Ohh.. since when we have to downgrade our expert's opinion? Just because they (the foreigners) come from a different country and give different opinions doesn't mean that what they said are correct. And doesn't mean they are not political influenced as well. So, what next? An advice from a Thai expert on how to run our country? notwithstanding the fact that their former leader are now seeking asylum from other country and is charged for corruption back home.
This is a political death. DAP needs to cover their behinds as lots of beans have spilled out.
MACC also has to cover their backs too because they found some of the spilled beans.
Therefore, if motive appears to be the issue, then DAP stands to gain by not having a trial witness.
On the other hand, it would be rather silly for MACC to shit in their own kitchen.
Perhaps the last person to see TBH alive could shed some light?
A GOOD MAN DOES NOTHING.
Local Forensics Analysis and Works paid by: Malaysian Taxpayers
Relationship with Paymasters: Govt servant and Trustee of Rakyat
Pornstar Analysis and Works paid by: Those wishing to see Govt of the Day down
Relationship with Paymasters: Buddy-buddy in Human-Rights Associations
(i)
Malaysian Govt Diagnosis: Maybe Murdered, Maybe Suicide
Methodology: Physical Inspection of Body
Pornstar Diagnosis: Most likely Murdered
Methodology: See photograph only
(ii)
Malaysia Govt Diagnosis: TBH still alive when fell
How conclusion was arrived: Physical Autopsy of Body
Pornstar Diagnosis: TBH already dead
Methodology: READ autopsy report only
(iii)
Malaysia Govt Diagnosis: Butt caught sharp object during plunge down
How conclusion was arrived: Physical Autopsy of Body
Pornstar Diagnosis: TBH already dead
Methodology: READ autopsy report only
And how aboput these from Fatimah Zuhri’s blog:-
“Earlier in the day Dr Pornthip suggested round marks on Teoh’s neck could mean ‘manual strangulation’ with fingers. When she was given Teoh’s photos in order for her to spot any signs strangulations she had described earlier, she could not find any.”
“Dr Pornthip also said she didn’t get copies of all documents from the Selangor government which engaged her services.”
Aiyaaa itu macam kaa? Boleh sorok sorok and give only certain documents to be shown and not some others?
Ali Bakawali
Bro
In Kugan's case, the head of MMC, Dr. Merican also passed judgement without actually examining 1 inch of Kugan's body.
He based his verdict of no foul play based strictly on a review of the autopsies done by 2 pathologists.
What's good for the M'sian goose must surely be good for the Thai gander?
dpp
We are all of 1 race, the Human Race
DontPlayPundek,
Your must be referring to Ali Bakawali's writing. There is some difference: Dr Merican wasn't paid 120K an hour, (heck you pay me half that amount and I will sell my mother!), his conclusion was inline with the pathologists while in this case the conclusion of the pornstar was the exact opposite to the ones who did the real-live autopsy: anything at all as long as it is OPPOSITE! As much as how this pundek would write anything as long as it is opposite to what the government says!
Aiyya Pundek you tak mau visit itu Deminegara website lagi with your clever rantings aaaa? We miss you maaa.
Folks, for those not in the know, the way this pundek got busted in DemiNegara ... normally one just wouldn't have the energy to bangun lagi.
Now he does the clever thing: Spread venoms only to those relatively lenient blogs, like Syed's here.
Nak buat macam Eyes Wide Open: kene bantai dalam DemiNegara sampai terduduk and then bina blog sendiri dan hopefully invite people into his turf, TAK JADI pulak because his blog went unvisited and unpopular.
Nak keep on harping and being applauded by the by-default anti-Govt visitors in MalaysiaKini and MalaysiaToday he is too smart for that, for he knows those two websites are not representative of the true rakyat's voice, after barring some pro-malay and pro-Govt comments by the hundreds.
So he goes to DemiNegara to try nasib there. The outcome is as you all can see and read.
Really, pundek, if I were you, I would just shut up and play with my grandchildren. Eh and also, now that Najib in the recent budget dah sponsor 20M to small indian business enterpreneurs, why not you start a small one selling lotus garlands in use with Kavadi processions? I mean, its a government incentive, you know? Who knows, you might begin to be of use for you, your family and perhaps the small community surrounding you.
Hahahaha! Pathetic!
DontPlayPundekFoe
Who bantai TBH bontot?
Since Dr Porn did not examine TBH body and judgement from the photos and report, how did Dr Porn come to conclusion that TBH anus was punctured?
80:20, sound like Pareto's principle to me.
MRSM Kalae Chepo 66/73
P/s To Anon Thursday, October 22, 2009 1:57:00 AM
I am a graduate of Top 4 Uni of the Planet Earth according to 2009 THES. I do not think I am freaking smart, in fact, I know depite of expertise in my field of knowledge, I too did a few mistakes (inspite of getting paid handsomely for my services). So, the THES World Unis ranking has nothing to do with individual expertise.
Perhaps in this instance Dr Porn could also be wrong. A true expert will relish opportunity to be proven wrong.
MRSM Kalae Chepo 66/73
The kithab remind us that in the final days of reaconing,our hand and feets will speaks as witness.
An expert is an expert regardless of nationality. The advantage of having a foreign expert is that he/she is less likely to be under the influence or pressure from any local authority and thus is free to offer his/her professional opinion impartially.
Of course we can always claim that she was probably paid by the certain party to offer such verdict, thus she is driven by a hidden agenda more than by her professionalism. However, if we were to make such claim, we must first offer proof to support such allegation and at the same time be ready to prove that those local experts hired by MCCA on our side are equally not guilty of similar suspicion.
Dr Porntip never say she is 100% right and she never claimed that her finding is conclusive. What she meant was the possibility of homicide, according to her experience ( and we cannot disregard her experiences) is very high. In order to confirm her opinion she therefore offered for second autopsy.
Although it is true that all experts are human being and therefore possible to err, but if we were to prove her wrong, it must be done according to proper scientific manner.
If we are ready to disregard what an expert has to say, then we must also be consistent in judging other non- experts who made similarly conclusive statement that TBH's death is suicide.
In another word, with the same logic, if we are ready to accept the fact that an expert is human being and thus can make mistake, similarly we must apply the same consistent measurement on the other side. What make us think that a non-expert (also human being) doesn't make mistake by claiming otherwise?
There were some parties obviously are no pathologist yet have made confident claim that TBH's death is not homicide.
I am an expert/ PHD in architecture graduated from a particular world class university doesn't mean I am also an expert/PHD in aerospace. Being an expert in one field doesn't give me the authority to judge the other field.
It's also non-scientific to claim that a pathologist cannot come to certain conclusion by merely observing photographs, unless we too are expert and authoritative in pathology. If we are not expert in this field, who are we to conclude that such methodology is not acceptable in that particular field?
On the other hand, if we are expert in the same area, then please kindly offer your scientific point of view why it cannot be accepted from pathology point of view?
Please refer to the following link. Overlook the sneering remarks but just consider the point of views.
http://mt.m2day.org/2008/content/view/28112/84/
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